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Oct 1 - 10, 2005


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(Quotes from Ed in Red)


Sun, 9 Oct 2005

Sugar #11

Hello Ed,


What does your system say on entry and exit price?

Trend Following systems do not speak about entry and exit prices.


Trading at price levels is a methodology that goes with fundamental analysis and/or trend fading systems.




Trend Following Systems Say Nothing


about the past or future


Clip: http://users.cybercity.dk/


Sun, 9 Oct 2005


Math Typo

Hi Ed,

As per website, Equity from ACAGR:

Equity = OriginalEquity ^

(DateRangeInYears * CAGR)

The formula, as per definition of ACAGR, is:

Equity = OriginalEquity * (1 + ACAGR)^DateRangeInYears

Good Catch. The item now stands correctly, with illustrative computational examples.

Sat, 8 Oct 2005



yesterday and tomorrow
seduce me out of living
and deliver without effort
a gift which I decline

in my declination, incredulous am I
to be here once again
in a cul-de-sac of intricate design

The manic search for culprits
like a cyclone in my head
the eye of which cannot see
its beauty or its truth

The horror and frustration
to my mind...
a rational torture
to my soul...
a place to grow

Thank you for sharing your process.




In a Cyclone


the eye is at the zero point



Clip: http://agora.ex.nii.ac.jp/digital-typhoon/news/2003/ZOE/eye.jpg

Fri, 7 Oct 2005


ATR Formula


I am not able to duplicate your ATR numbers using TradersStudio standard functions for ATR, and apparently I don't understand the formula that you are using, because I can't even calculate the ATR as it is in your log, with the numbers in your log.

1. The ATR is 20 day, right? (Not 25, as in DaysToWarmUp =25)


2. How is "True Range" = "The Maximum Price Range During the Period Between Two Closes" calculated? Are you using Max/Min of the Close only over the 20 days, or just the close only delta of 20 days ago?

3. This True Range above is then averaged but "AverageTrueRange" = "The Lag of True Range" = "Also: The Moving Average of True Range". Is this a 20 day Exponential Moving Average, or a simple 20 day Average?

4. Am I using the right metrics log for the 15/150 system? (Metrics_Log_0.0 2005 09 22.txt attached, which was downloaded from the web site on 9/22/05)


 5. Using just the data in the Metrics_Log_0.0 2005 09 22.txt (attached). What is the formula that you are using to get the answer ATR=11.472 on 05-07-22?

The ATR for today is the greater of:

1. Today's High - Today's Low.

2. Today's High - Yesterday's Close.

3. Yesterday's Close - Today's Low.

The "20 day" Lag of ATR uses a Time Constant of (n + 1)/2 = 10.5 days.


See Resources at TSP, above for more information.



 Fri, 7 Oct 2005


401-Keg Aluminum Investment Theory

If you had purchased $1,000.00 of Nortel stock, it could now be worth about $49.00.


With Enron, you might have had only $16.50 left of the original $1,000.00.


With WorldCom, you would have had less than $5.00 left.


But ... if you had purchased $1,000.00 worth of beer about a year or so ago, drank all of the beer, and then turned the cans in for the aluminum recycling REFUND fee, you would now have over $200.00 !!!

Based on this, the best current investment advice is; drink heavily and recycle.


We could call this plan; The 401-Keg plan.





Investment Biker


Marketing her cans.


Clip: http://www.bikernet.com/


Thu, 06 Oct 2005


Using Excel for TSP

Hi Ed,

You mention that we can follow along on the trading system project by using Excel. Being a beginner at Excel, do you have any suggestions on what resources might provide an understanding on how to use it for our purposes?


I've been browsing the internet and reading about Excel quite a bit in its help section, but can't seem to find the information that would allow me to take the raw data and calculate the moving averages, the buy/sell points, optimization, etc. I'm pretty much starting from scratch but willing to learn.

You might consider taking your feelings of helplessness to your Tribe as an entry point.




For Some People


helplessness is a life style.



Clip: http://helpless.fmconcepts.us/


Thu, 06 Oct 2005


Data Vendors

Ed - Which data vendors would you recommend for futures data?

FAQ does not recommend commercial products.  See Ground Rules.

Thu, 6 Oct 2005


Tribe Meeting Recap

Hello Ed,

At the most recent Tribe meeting, my snapshot, at best, is out of focus. My fellow Tribe members do a great job of letting me know the latter and that gets me into feeling my feelings for the remainder of the snapshot process. I make the commitment to myself to bring more clarity to my snapshot and I take the live feelings of having a fuzzy snapshot into the Tribe Meeting in the evening.

Clear Snapshot

The name of my snapshot is “Sticking to My System”. I derive my snapshot from a lifetime of experiences of not sticking to my system, or any system for that matter, in some aspects of my life. I realize that as I stick to my system in the NOW, life just seems to flow, things get simpler, and I’m happier and have this feel food feeling most of the time. Things like frustration, anxiety, second guessing and just plain general “pissed-off-ness” melt away.

The intent of my snapshot is to get me the experience that sticking to my system in trading demonstrates to me that I can stick to whatever system I have the INTENT to stick with in my life. These “systems” in life are endless and can include living healthy, being forthright and honest with myself and others, growing my net worth and living a joyful, truthful and Loving life. Thus, if I can stick to my trading system, I can stick to whatever system I choose to do so as long as I have the INTENT to stick with it.

The title to my snapshot is “Sticking to My System”. In my snapshot I proudly hold a trade report detailing 20 trades that I take in accordance with my trading system. I hold the report with my right hand. My knuckles on the right hand are just above level with the top of my head so that my head is slightly tilted upwards. My left arm is fully extended with a fist clenched hard and veins popping out of my forearms, much like the fist pump a baseball player makes as he rounds bases after hitting the game winning homerun. I have a HUGE smile, and a very satisfied look, as I take in a Trade Report that clearly shows me sticking to my system.

The Trade Report is composed from three data spreadsheets – ACTUAL, SYSTEM, VARIANCE; with following details in each spreadsheet:

- Entry Date/Time

- Exit Date/Time

- Product Symbol

- Side of Trade (Long/Short)

- Quantity of contracts

- +/- Number of Points per Trade

- Gross Profit/Loss per Trade

- Net Profit/Loss per Trade

- Strategy for Trade

- Comments Section

The ACTUAL spreadsheet data is directly from my broker statement, SYSTEM data is from SYSTEM generated signals, and VARIANCE is the delta between ACTUAL and SYSTEM.

On the Trade Report there are seven rows:

1. Trade Number

2. Entry Date/Time

3. Exit Date/Time

4. Product Symbol

5. Side of Trade

6. Net Profit/Loss per Trade

7. Variance Between ACTUAL and SYSTEM Net Profit/Loss per Trade

The Trade Report clearly demonstrates that all ACTUAL trades are executed from SYSTEM signals and any VARIANCE is minimal and due to slippage. There is GREEN, showing positive number of points at the bottom ACTUAL points column. My snapshot is NOW clear, “I stick to my system”, and it feels great! I complete the 11th trade, attached is the most recent spreadsheets and Trade Report.

The Tribe Meeting

The Process Manager (PM) is very focused and business like for this meeting. We begin shortly after dinner with 10 members present. After a few hot seat sessions by fellow participants, I take the feelings of having a fuzzy, unfocused snapshot into the hot seat. I begin by describing the feelings of having a blurry snapshot and I use my hands in an attempt to better describe the feeling, the process manager jumps right in and tells me to do more of what I’m doing with my hands, and then bam! Things get dark, and whatever it is I’m doing, I just go faster and faster, it gets very dark and very hot, darker and hotter, darker, and darker.

In prior hot seat sessions I stop to describe what I’m seeing, feeling or going through. Ed reminds me that it’s probably best “just to go with it” and not to articulate anything, to just get “more into the feeling”. I follow Ed’s guidance for the present session and things just get darker and hotter, I sense my body parts flinging all over the place and it just gets hotter and darker. I just go faster and faster, with my hands and my body just takes over. I get to a point and hear the Tribe encouraging me to “hold it, right there, hold it, that’s it! HOLD it! RIDE it at the EDGE, HOLD it!” I do and then I’m back, perspiration all over, I’m soaked. Just a few minutes of this and I’m sweating more than I do after a 2 hour work out, unreal fatigue.

I get right back into it after a brief time out. It gets hot again, and even darker, I get a feeling in my chest, I begin to rub it, “…harder, faster! There you go, great work! MORE! MORE!, etc…”. The tribe is great at relentless validation. I get into the feelings and come back once more, same stuff, dark, hot, body going wild and then in an instant I see whiteness, out of nowhere, it is white, darkness is gone.

I begin to see into my body, like there’s a camera attached to my brain with the lens pointed at me from outside my body and looking into me. I see a pylon, very precise, being lowered into the core of my body, through the frontal spine, just barreling down. It’s almost like a construction crew lowering this massive pylon into the ground that will provide support for a gigantic building. The pylon is barreling down into my body. I come back and I’m awake.

My fellow tribe members check out and I describe the pylon as I check out. I get an AHA as I realize that as I work on experiencing my feelings, the pylon represents my mind opening a huge tunnel into my body so as to allow the feelings access, or a way out of my body. Also, I realize that the “construction crew” lowering the pylon was actually my mind leading the way as it begins to embrace and facilitate (by ‘helping’ construct the tunnel) alignment with Fred. This is good, the crack in the feelings dam is breaking, I can hardly wait for the gush of feelings to come roaring out.

We break for the night and as usual I cannot sleep after tribe meetings. Just toss and turn for hours until the sun comes up. It’s really weird, because I hardly ever have a problems sleeping. In fact, I sleep more on the short flight home than all night long after the meeting.

Ed, I say thank you to you because that is all I can really say. But part of myself tells me that you get my “thank you” in some other form that I just begin to understand but that my internal “construction crew” is aware of and hurriedly trying to get to. Thank you to my fellow tribe members, I greatly appreciate your effort and support.

Thank you for sharing your process.




The Path is Generally Easy to See


and difficult to follow



Clip: http://static.flickr.com/


Thu, 6 Oct 2005


More Mandelbrot

In reply to Mon, 26 Sep 2005 FAQ I send you in attachment some images of our first indicator base in fractal Mandelbrot formula.

We make some back testing with a good result but, like I said in the last email, the indicator is good to tell us when the trend is bend not to give as output signal. We don't like generate primary buy or sell signals with this indicator. We use the indicator like a secondary signal.

I attachment a excel sheet with our first indicator testing in some Portuguese stocks. A good result.





we make:




C is Close Price and V1, V2 e V3 is the random variables.

You seem to have a rather loose indicator, not a rigorous system.  For an examples of actual systems, see TSP, above.


Discretionary Indicators are generally playgrounds for Fred; they lead to lots of Drama relating to trying to guess the non-existing future.




Playgrounds are Good Places to Exercise


Not so good for trading.



Clip: http://www.usma.edu/mwr/


Wed, 5 Oct 2005




On your link:




under the heading Summary Chart you write:

For double moving average systems with the fast TC = 5%, values of slow TC below 50% are profitable. See seventh line.

I think the results are in the second line.

Thank you for a great site.

Thank you for the catch.  The 3-rd line holds the result.

Wed, 5 Oct 2005


Sharp Eye

Dear Ed,

I'm just here to say I'm very thankful for the contributor for his recent FAQ (Testimonial, 9/21/05). He puts his experience clearly and vividly that I feel like I go through the experience with him. It's so good that I read it through carefully, word by word - highly unusual for me. I've learned tremendously and I'm very grateful. I too want to give him a big hug as an encouragment, for his commitment, going through all the ups and downs, and sharing his ahas. I admire his honesty and openness. Hearing his words inspire me and I now also proclaim my genuine intention to commit to honoring and validating my feelings, EVERY feeling, and others' feelings as well.

Now here are my questions. The author suggests that "support people by encouraging them to keep doing what they are doing. Even in situations where I can see a potentially negative outcome." I can see how doing so is validating them and their feelings.


However, what if the person is an alcohol-abuse spouse/parent? I don't think I can encourage such behavior, as it may be very destructive to those around him. (Although according to the Responsibility Model, the alcholic's family - including his infant son who cannot even walk yet - is also responsible for getting abused by his drunken father). Am I misinterpreting, or is it that I'm still holding some judgement?

What about in a situation where I hurt other people's feelings? Say I make a comment and others feel deeply hurt. Do I support her to feel the hurt feelings by giving more abrasive comments? (That sounds absurd to me) I'm guessing I can share my feelings with her ("I feel sorry for hurting your feeling"), but what if she refuses to listen (cover her ears, turn her back against me, run away, not answering...)? Do I then encourage and strengthen her refusal of ignoring me by ignoring her? (That sounds even worse) I very much appreciate your insights, Ed. Many thanks.



I also enclose some possible (very minor) grammatical mistakes that I find, since the author asks for feedbacks on such mistakes I just try to help and contribute in whatever way I can. I'm usually not a good grammar person, and I'm surprised that I read his testimonal so closely, in such details, word by word, that I manage to discover some possible trivial mistakes.

"I recall roll playing a situation with Ed"
roll playing -> role playing

"I start becoming more clear"
more clear -> clearer

"Immediately I start feeling my ex-girlfriends feelings"
ex-girlfriends -> ex-girlfriend's

"After I Breathwork is over and I come back to earth"
After I Breathwork -> After Breathwork

"She agrees that she is wants to get clear"
she is wants -> she wants

"For the last four years I have been so controlling that I did allow you to feel that feeling"
I did allow -> I didn't allow

Thank you for the corrections.  Incidentally, you have a few of your own, now in blue.


You might consider taking your fear of hurting someone else's feelings to your Tribe as an entry point.  By the way, I wonder how you think you might go about hurting someone else's pain. 


Since you seem to have sharp eyes, you might enjoy this puzzle:




TT Puzzle Corner


See if you can spot the hidden car.



Clip: http://www.mozartsghostonline.com/



Tue, 4 Oct 2005


German Translation of TTP -

the Trading Tribe Process


Dear Chief,

In order to grow the Austrian tribe and to promote TTP in the German speaking world I translate the TTP-The Trading Tribe Process into German.
I set up a webspace (non-commercial).


Your introductory paper TTP-The Trading Tribe Process is in German on
http://tradingtribe.airmode.de/prozess.html .

Sehr nett! Jetzt haben wir ein deutsch Übersetzung für das Verfahren.




The Trading Tribe Book


Now available in

English, Canadian, British and



Tue, 04 Oct 2005


The Slippery Slope


What’s as important to realize as that we have a dictatorship is why we now have one.


Surely, this can be seen as simply the latest twist in the same old game of power and corruption that’s been playing itself out since the founding of the Republic—no, since the beginning of civilization itself.


But there’s more. Now the folks in charge realize that it will soon be impossible to maintain the entitlements that have enabled the U.S. to function as a quasi-democracy for many long.


If a minority is to preserve its comforts, this will be at the expense of shattered living standards for the majority.


The only way to keep a lid on such circumstances, the elites have evidently concluded, is with brutal force. For a time, a large segment of the population can be cajoled into supporting the regime by cowing the media and shaping its messages, and by manipulating hot-button issues (religion, sex, and terrorism) in the political arena.


But in the end popular support is optional.


You might take your feelings about government to your Tribe as an entry point.





Riding Down The Slippery Slope


Lots of Fun for the Entire Family


While it Lasts.



Clip: http://image.guardian.co.uk/



Mon, 3 Oct 2005



Dear Ed,

You might consider including "snapshot" in the TTP glossary. The glossary is helpful to me. Thanks.

The item now appears in the glossary.

Mon, 3 Oct 2005



At our last tribe meeting I arrive for the afternoon session feeling quite excited. We begin to go through the snapshot process, and as I explain where I am with it, I feel anxious and nervous.

Later on in the evening the tribe meeting begins. I feel the anxiety and a swirling in my chest. I volunteer to take the hotseat. The process manager suggests I get into the feeling in my chest. I begin to squeeze my arms inward, press on my chest, and extend my legs. I feel immense pressure and pain in my heart. I recall the night before going through the wedding pictures with my wife and seeing my parents who divorced several years back. I feel my mother's pain, pain we discussed for the first time less than a week before. I feel I never really received her feelings before, only on the surface. I have always had the urge to have her be happy or make her happy but never to receive her feelings.

I go through a handful of forms and the process manager suggests I begin to integrate them. Upon integrating them, I feel transported through the back of my seat into an incredible state of bliss. These feelings have likely been repressed since I was a kid and the feeling of letting them up is liberating.

I notice since the hotseat a conversation with my mother is much deeper and much more meaningful. I feel we have begun communicating on a whole new level. I notice since practicing TTP my relationship with both of my parents has dramatically improved. We are much more open and supportive of each other. Dramas, I am now aware I used to create, are unnecessary now. I commit to work to improve all my relationships.


Thank you for sharing your process.

Mon, 3 Oct 2005



Thanks for the reply, sir.

I've written my own function to flag limit up/downs. When I finish, I start thinking - what is the right thing to do once I am in a limit up position trying to buy? OK, under the trend-following principle, my only concern is to follow the trend, and so I just keep updating buy orders until I get filled. After one day of limit up, no problem. Two days, no problem. Three days, I'm guessing there is small hesitation. What about a week? Can I comfortably buy after it has gone a week of limit-ups? What about two weeks?

I see myself having doubts if I am in a situation to buy after days after days after days of limit ups. I feel like missing out on the trade. In those particular conditions, there is a huge selection bias that the very fact that I get filled likely means that the move is over. (If I'm trying to hop on a runaway train, but it won't let me get on in its initial burst and I'm trying to catch-up, then logically if I do catch it up it just indicates that it must have slowed down significantly).

Can you please share some of your experience?


Playing for comfort and searching for meanings are both counterproductive to Trend Following.

You might take your concerns to your Tribe as entry points.




Getting Comfortable


is one way to make sure

you miss some good moves.



Clip: http://freespace.virgin.net/


Mon, 03 Oct 2005



I am recently introduced to TTP. Breathwork, hot seat/reception, NLP and other techniques are similar to some I have become familiar with and attached to as a function of getting sober.


I am encouraged to find a capitalist allowing for the weave of whole person with the profitability of mature behavior in the markets.

How vital do you consider the grasp of calculus and C++ programming language to be in the pursuit of success in futures trading?

Grateful to life for the introduction to your fine work.

Thank you for sharing your path.


Many positions in the futures industry do not require knowledge of calculus or programming.


Even in the analytical areas, C++ is becoming less necessary. Basic, C, C++, C#, Excel and other languages seem to be merging into a common foundation language.


Sobriety is essential in pursuing TTP and other spiritual paths. Using inhibits key functions essential to working through k-nots.




Freedom of Motion




Freedom of Speech




Freedom From Using

is the best high



next to Free Enterprise,

of course.












Mon, 3 Oct 2005


Defiance, Quitting and Stuffing

Hi Ed,

It is 2 weeks since the last meeting and yet again I fail to honor my commitment to eat well and regularly exercise. There is not much for me to contribute to our snapshot review session other than to be honest and open about how I do nothing to work toward my snapshot.

In the evening I am the first member to take the hotseat. The willingness to take the seat is a big step, but immediately my normal defense mechanisms go to work.


I get into a form and the tribe supports me and encourages me to do more. Unfortunately this has the opposite effect and I quickly stuff the feelings and come out of the form. The tribe tries various attempts to alternatively provoke and encourage me.


A strong feeling of DON'T TELL ME WHAT TO DO comes up. The tribe encourages me to get into that feeling, but all I want to do is tell everyone to "shut the f--- up and don't tell me what to do." There is emotion, feeling as well as a form behind this but as quick as the feelings come up I do my best to put a lid on them and put myself in a calm place back on my seat.

The tribe picks up that DEFIANCE and QUITTING are two things that I really enjoy. In the real world rather than experience defiance, quitting and various others feelings I use food to stuff my feelings.


In an ideal TTP world I experience these feelings fully with the support of the tribe and untie the knots. I am unable and unwilling to go further at this meeting ... intention = result . The process manager explains I can untie the knots. The thing to do is try very hard and experience the feelings that go with trying very hard not to untie the knots. As the conscience mind kicks in that certainly is a difficult concept to handle.

Since Oct '03 I attend 2 workshops, 2 Breathwork sessions and regular tribe meetings. I question 'WHY' I still have the same issues and do not improve.


The process manager explains that TTP is not a cure, but rather an on going process. This makes a lot of sense to me and when I return home and re-read the Trading Tribe book chapter titled Why Questions Don't Work I am even more clear. There is more work to do and I continue my commitment to TTP.


Thank you for sharing your process. 


K-nots that involve inter-locking forms such as defiance, stuffing and quitting yield to loosening one part, then another, then another until the whole k-not spills.


It seems you are coming more and more out of denial and addressing the issues.



Cleopatra Dies


and finally gives up being

the Queen of Denial



Clip: http://www.illusionsgallery.com/




Mon, 03 Oct 2005


New Zealand

Hello Ed - from New Zealand,

I see there is no Intentional Community here. You suggested starting one. What would be involved in doing that?


See the Directory Page, above.

Sun, 2 Oct 2005

Fear of Judgment

I would like to ask the price of the upcoming TT Workshop.


I would also like to request a conversation with you to discuss the issues I would like to work on in tribe meetings.


I feel anxiety that the others at meetings will judge me. I often made decisions due to the fear of being judged by others. I sabotage my efforts at becoming more successful. I commit to change the fact that I sabotage my efforts by attending the next TTP Workshop.


I was very inspired by the post on Wed, 21 Sep 2005. I thank you for acknowledging my feelings.

I am currently formulating a theme and price for the workshop.


If you want private consulting, see the bottom of the FAQ Index and Ground Rules Page.


You might consider taking your feelings about judgment to your Tribe as an entry point.




Judgment Day




Clip: http://www.suite101.com/files/articles/



Sun, 2 Oct 2005



Hi Chief!

I am already experiencing the beauty of Intention = result. I wanted someone to form a trading tribe and now there is one.

I commit to re-view (re-read) the Trading Tribe book.

I commit to saving the money to pay for the next TT Workshop.

I commit to join the next Trading Tribe Workshop.

I commit to send you weekly updates of Atlanta Tribe and my personal progress.


Sun, 2 Oct 2005





Are you planning another Breathwork weekend before the end of the year?


Sun, 2 Oct 2005

DIM Process - Doing It Myself

Dear Ed,

This is the first time I write to you. I learn about you like many of us who read your FAQs, through the Market Wizards book. Thank you, sincerely, for your efforts in making all this possible.  

To make this message brief, please allow me to get right to it.

This evening I take a 3 mile walk and decide to incorporate deep, continuous breathing to my exercise. My walk pace is comfortable such that it allows me to explore whatever feelings may appear without distractions (or so I think). It takes me about 51 minutes to complete it. I don't know anything about Holotropic Breathing. All I know is how to breathe to stay alive and Fred takes care of that. 

I notice at first that I have problems concentrating on my diaphragmatic breathing and a couple of times in the course of my walk I distract myself with the surrounding area and without noticing I go back to my normal breathing. I then correct myself. 

After a good 15 minutes, I start getting into a current emotional issue that bothers me beyond anything else I feel in years. I don't know how to deal with it. Where I live in [Country] there are no trading tribes. It's through my nephew, who lives in [USA], that I order your book this summer. One of my daughters, a friend of hers and I, have our first tribe meeting this coming week. We all have issues, but after discussing what we want to explore in our sessions, we conclude it's me who really needs the help.

As I continue walking and breathing deep and continuous, my current emotional conflict starts surfacing and soon I find myself feeling the usual, ugly emotional pain, but without experiencing any somatic feeling. However, tears are streaming out of my eyes as feelings of sadness and impotence overwhelm me.

Toward the last part of my walk, I have what I think is a major Aha that allows me to feel good about the feeling that's been tormenting me for the last few months. This is really exciting because for the first time since I start reading your FAQs in 2003, I can finally relate to what I constantly read on your site.  

Although the feeling is good and the clarity is welcome, I have doubts about what is really happening. For one, I am a desperate man who in dire need of help is trying to achieve certain results by doing something I don't know anything about.

The breathing exploration I do as I walk tonight is just an experiment, a cry for help if I may, to find a way to alleviate an ugly feeling fueled by what I call, my emotional inadequacies. I don't even know if I'm breathing right.  

I get what to me seems to be a major Aha because I feel much better about my issue and the people involved in it toward the end of my walk, but by the same token, given that this particular issue has been such a big player in my emotional life these past few months, I doubt getting an Aha is possible so easily and under those circumstances. If I sound vague, I apologize; I'm trying to save space and your time if you get to read this. 

It's over 3 hours since I finished walking. The issue that torments me is still with me, but its volume and its disruptive effects are only a small portion of their usual selves. And yes, I can feel its positive intention, it makes perfect sense and I embrace it and accept it. However, something is still left in there, and the reason behind my writing to you, are the following questions: Is my Aha for real? Is it only a partial Aha? Is there a healing process taking place in this case, but somehow still remains incomplete?  

I decide to walk and breathe as opposed to try my own dopey version of Holotropic Breathing by myself, alone, at home. It scares the heck out of me to imagine what Fred may send out to greet me. 

I am a total stranger to you, but you have no idea how close and familiar you are to us.

TTP is not about deciding who needs help.  It is about trading turns validating each other and experiencing forms.


TTP is not about taking walks and breathing by ourselves. It is about meeting as a Tribe and accepting the support of others.


You might take your issues of wanting to do it by yourself to your Tribe.



While Quality Alone Time

is essential


it is incidental to TTP.



Clip: http://www.birthmombuds.com/i_cry.htm


Sat, 1 Oct 2005



Good day,

I would like your permission to start a "Trading Tribe" in Orlando Florida.

Thanks for your time and best wishes,










Sat, 1 Oct 2005




During our last afternoon snapshot process, and during a few other previous snapshot processes, our process manager noticed that when I describe my snapshot, I mumble. Further, I look down at my paper and not at other members of the group. In other settings, I do not do this. But here, I do. I decide to take my mumbling to the hotseat later that evening.

I raise my hand to volunteer to go on the hotseat, The project manager suggests I get into the feeling of wanting to mumble by mumbling to the group. I begin to mumble and notice I really don’t like it. The project manager comments that the fact that I don’t like it creates the need for me to do it. He, along with the tribe, helps me find the feeling behind my negative judgment about my mumbling.

I begin to scream and shake my fists, stomp my feet and crunch into a ball as I get into the hate behind the judgment that I don’t like to mumble. I do this for a while as I enjoy it and the feeling passes. I get much validation and reinforcement from my tribe members while I do this. Once this passes I go back to the mumbling and find that I can celebrate it and really get into it. The project manager suggests that I have fun with the mumbling and really enjoy it. So I really get into having fun with the mumbling. I mumble many different ways and start laughing in the process. Many in the tribe laugh as well with my creative ways to mumble. I feel like a professional mumbler.

The project manager suggests that I put my forms together: fists, stomping, crunching, and mumbling all at the same time. I do this four times. Each time the intensity of the feelings decreases a little bit, but I don't feel like I exhaust the feelings. On the fifth time, I fall and roll to the floor in a ball. I land on my back clutching my knees. The tribe cheers me on. Everything releases and I lay on the floor with my legs and arms outstretched in a very peaceful position. I feel I make friends with my mumbling. I look forward to the next tribe snapshot afternoon meeting to see what happens. If the mumbling comes, I intend to fully experience and celebrate the feeling in the moment. This is something I have never done but for the hotseat.

Thank you for sharing your process.




When You Don't Have a Straight Answer






CLip: http://www.jimboren.com/inataprobuhead.gif

Sat, 1 Oct 2005



Hi Don Eduardo:

Ed says on September 26:
Complex is sometimes just an attempt to hide.

This comment of yours caught my attention.

Although I respect and admire Dr. William Eckhardt for his knowledge in the scientific field, I feel he tries to make simple things as complicated as possible with comments like:

“There is no doubt the game has become much more difficult” – The New Market Wizards . Meaning that mechanical trading systems do not work as well as in the past."

Another one:

"...Eventually artificial intelligence devices, superior to any human researcher, will effectively uncover all exploitable nonlinear relationships of price to price. Such relationships will be mined until technical analysis is no longer profitable. There is an irony in that dogmatic" random walk" theorists, dead wrong for a century, will turn out to have been prescient--futures markets will have been driven to randomness. The process has already begun.

I feel these developments are nearly assured (assuming no disruption of civilization). What is less clear is whether this will happen as rapidly as I predict -- in 10 to 20 years. In the meantime, profitable trading will only get harder as increasingly more astute traders pursue Progressively weaker statistical regularities. This is why it is necessary for a CTA continually to improve just to hold his or her own. The only consolation I can offer is that there are profits to be made participating in this process of randomization ..."


Perhaps he is unconsciously becoming a future futures trader instead of a present futures trader .


You might consider addressing your concerns to Dr. Eckhardt.




Sometimes Complication Adds

little more than





Clip: www.jameswjohnson.com/


Sat, 1 Oct 2005



As of the 1st day of September, 2005, I report total assets under management as $394,727.

In September I raise a bit (about $45,000) of new money from an existing client. I continue to present my program to CTA allocators and people in the industry as well as high net worth individuals. So far, I have more promising responses from wealthy individuals than I do from traditional

I am pleased to have an up month for September, and I feel like my program is hitting pretty much on all cylinders since I expand the portfolio to include all the markets I wish to trade. I sense that the main way to improve performance now is to raise more assets.

In October, I plan to find new people to share the story of my business with and to ask them to invest with me.

I continue to commit to report to you as my support team until I achieve and report USD 5 million under my management.

Hmmm ... you are raising new money at a rate of about 13% per month.  That's a gain of over 300% per year.




Exponential Growth

compounds quickly at 300% per year.


You can also make a fortune

compounding at 2% per year

although many people

have trouble sitting through

the first 400 years.



Clip: http://users.rcn.com/jkimball.ma.ultranet/


Sat, 01 Oct 2005


Trading System Project

Hello again Ed,

Hope it isn't too late to join in on the trading system project! I should be receiving my system testing program in a couple days.


I'm rather new to creating and testing parameters but I'm working hard to understand the info you have included about the project. I can hardly wait!

You can follow along with a spreadsheet program.




Spreadsheet Programs


have enough features

to follow along with TSP


and enable you to see

under the hood.